The Frock Coat Collar

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The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Mojo Turbo on Wed Oct 05, 2011 7:34 pm

NOT PICTURES OF THE COSTUME COAT

Just to be clear this "costume coat" I bought has this "style" collar:

http://jacksparrowcostuming.wikispaces.com/file/view/jacks_coat_frock.jpg

and NOT a full collar like Button It (or the real Jack) has on his jacket

http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/s720x720/316848_10150391713701350_161963556349_10509226_735874745_n.jpg

And I believe the button trim was copied from this touring coat

https://2img.net/h/i119.photobucket.com/albums/o133/Elavyan/Starstruck%20in%20Cathedral/PotC/Ldn873.jpg

Since it also has the trim on upside down - which I have only seen on THIS Jacket, so it's either a stunt coat, or a mistake


Last edited by Mojo Turbo on Fri Oct 07, 2011 11:03 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Capt Jag on Thu Oct 06, 2011 8:05 am

"Just to be clear this "costume coat" has this style collar:

http://jacksparrowcostuming.wikispaces.com/file/view/jacks_coat_frock.jpg"



So, is the first pic of the actual coat - the one that comes in the full costume kit?
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Mojo Turbo on Thu Oct 06, 2011 8:50 am

no, those were all reference examples

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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Button It on Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:05 pm

Mojo Turbo wrote:NOT PICTURES OF THE COSTUME COAT

Just to be clear this "costume coat" has this "style" collar:

http://jacksparrowcostuming.wikispaces.com/file/view/jacks_coat_frock.jpg

and NOT a full collar like Button has on his jacket

http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/s720x720/316848_10150391713701350_161963556349_10509226_735874745_n.jpg


I'm not sure quite what your views on the collar are but mine is the same as the film used one - you just can't ever see it as the dreads normally cover it.
On your wiki on one pattern you said
"...has a pattern for a Military or Civilian coat. Just make sure you adjust the cuffs to the right width, and leave off the collar."
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Mojo Turbo on Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:58 pm

well this is Jack's screen used coat and it has no collar

http://jacksparrowcostuming.wikispaces.com/file/view/jacks_coat_frock.jpg

so that's my point.... so maybe he didn't have a collar in COTBP? I don't know which movie that coat is from

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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Button It on Thu Oct 06, 2011 2:03 pm

Mojo Turbo wrote:well this is Jack's screen used coat and it has no collar

http://jacksparrowcostuming.wikispaces.com/file/view/jacks_coat_frock.jpg

so that's my point.... so maybe he didn't have a collar in COTBP? I don't know which movie that coat is from

That's NOT a screen used coat. It looks like one I've seen that was listed as a screen used one, but it's as screen used as one of Moonies hat that was listed on ebay. The button holes should be a clue!

EDIT: A few more things that are immediately obvious off the top of my head, aside from the obviously wrong buttonhole trim:
buttonholes are facing the wrong way down the front.
not the right number of buttonholes on the cuffs
buttons aren't in the right arc shape under the pockets
buttons don't look quite right

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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Cap.cristianSparrow on Thu Oct 06, 2011 2:19 pm

Mojo Turbo wrote:well this is Jack's screen used coat and it has no collar

http://jacksparrowcostuming.wikispaces.com/file/view/jacks_coat_frock.jpg

so that's my point.... so maybe he didn't have a collar in COTBP? I don't know which movie that coat is from


Thats not an screen used coat !.
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Mojo Turbo on Thu Oct 06, 2011 3:02 pm

admittedly, I am no expert, but the auction says it's a stunt coat, so I assume it was made for the films

http://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/7457563

ha ha, but they do admit:
Of note, this jacket exhibits reverse button hole detailing from the hero coat.

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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Button It on Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:42 pm

Mojo Turbo wrote:admittedly, I am no expert, but the auction says it's a stunt coat, so I assume it was made for the films

http://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/7457563

ha ha, but they do admit:
Of note, this jacket exhibits reverse button hole detailing from the hero coat.

Yes - that was the auction I remember seeing. I remember doing some research on it a couple of years back and I think I found out it was remarkably similar to one of the makers out there it but I can't remember now.

I can't see how it could have so many things fundamentally different from the hero coat to even be used as they'd have made them all to the same spec and pattern. But even if it says so doesn't make it genuine!
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Cap.cristianSparrow on Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:52 pm

as far as i know, all the costumes - doesnt matter who wear it - .. are made exact the same. ( same pattern same fabric etc etc etc )
then they fix it a bit to the person who is gonna use. .
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Mojo Turbo on Thu Oct 06, 2011 5:13 pm

OK, but even admittedly, this touring coat has the button trim on backwards

https://2img.net/h/i119.photobucket.com/albums/o133/Elavyan/Starstruck%20in%20Cathedral/PotC/Ldn873.jpg

so... obviously mistakes happen

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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Cap.cristianSparrow on Thu Oct 06, 2011 5:20 pm

?? thats not an Original coat.. thats a REPRO .. check the size of the trim.
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Button It on Thu Oct 06, 2011 5:25 pm

You can only make so many mistakes before you'd be fired for complete incompetence! ;-)

Anyway, if there are so many inaccuracies in that coat, then it can't really be held up for scrutiny as a model for basing any real coat on. I've looked at pictures and I'm fairly sure that the proper coat from CotBP has a collar. I know for a fact that DMC onwards they do anyway.
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Mojo Turbo on Thu Oct 06, 2011 5:42 pm

Just so we are clear - there are 2 coats in my example - the backwards cuff trim coat is different.

That Coat is from a Display called "Starstruck at the Cathedral" their own marketing says, "see the costumes worn by the stars" It was at Worcester Cathedral.

But you think this coat is a reproduction?

https://s119.photobucket.com/albums/o133/Elavyan/Starstruck%20in%20Cathedral/PotC/#!cpZZ1QQtppZZ24

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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Cap.cristianSparrow on Thu Oct 06, 2011 5:55 pm

thats soo wrong...




but the girl on the website is saying.. costume repros!. so probably she made it for this "tour "
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Capn_Jack_Savvy on Thu Oct 06, 2011 6:19 pm

GD recasters!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Laughing

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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Button It on Fri Oct 07, 2011 2:07 am

Cap.cristianSparrow wrote:thats soo wrong...




but the girl on the website is saying.. costume repros!. so probably she made it for this "tour "

I noticed the cuff shape but it could be that it just wasn't put on properly and that the rest is just folded in on itself, otherwise it looks pretty good to me. Obviously quite a lot of the rest of the costume is fake, but to be so far out on things like boots hat and baldric and then to be so close with some of the detailing on the coat and waistcoat for example leads me to think that the coat probably is genuine, assuming the cuff thing is as I suspect.
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Bilge Rat on Fri Oct 07, 2011 5:18 pm

This coat seems way to big in size, wish they made it smaller, I would pick one up as a spare, but it appears too hugish!
Jack's coat is very small on him, fits very tight, I don't think he could button it if he tried, and it does not fit him in the shoulders, especially in the COTBP. Also does not fit his shoulders in DMC or AWE, you can see how tight is in the locker scenes.
This pic from COTBP shows how it's not wide enough, as Jack's shoulders protrude above the shoulders sewn into the coat, you can also see the collar that the COTBP coat had.
[img]
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  liarr on Fri Oct 07, 2011 5:36 pm

Bilge Rat wrote:This coat seems way to big in size, wish they made it smaller, I would pick one up as a spare, but it appears too hugish!
Jack's coat is very small on him, fits very tight, I don't think he could button it if he tried, and it does not fit him in the shoulders, especially in the COTBP. Also does not fit his shoulders in DMC or AWE, you can see how tight is in the locker scenes.
This pic from COTBP shows how it's not wide enough, as Jack's shoulders protrude above the shoulders sewn into the coat, you can also see the collar that the COTBP coat had.
[img]

Yes, I'm going to attempt to fix this. If not, I work in a Pirate Store. Someone will buy it.
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Mojo Turbo on Fri Oct 07, 2011 6:40 pm

but the girl on the website is saying.. costume repros!. so probably she made it for this "tour "

This website has the same picture you posted: http://www.curatedobject.us/the_curated_object_/opens-201105/

and it gives Penny Rose credit for the costume - small cuffs again (but clearly a collar) so the non-collar coat may clearly be a fraud.


you can also see the collar that the COTBP coat had.

you don't think that's his shirt collar?

http://www.houseofanoria.com/Pirate_Coat/Jack_POTC.jpg

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The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Bilge Rat on Fri Oct 07, 2011 8:05 pm

No, the shirt collar is white. The collar is the same fabric as the coat, you can see the the seam where is attached to the neck of the coat. It's only about an inch and a half high in the back and tapers down to almost nothing in the front.
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  adenry on Sat Oct 08, 2011 2:08 pm

Bilge Rat wrote:This coat seems way to big in size, wish they made it smaller, I would pick one up as a spare, but it appears too hugish!
Jack's coat is very small on him, fits very tight, I don't think he could button it if he tried, and it does not fit him in the shoulders, especially in the COTBP. Also does not fit his shoulders in DMC or AWE, you can see how tight is in the locker scenes.
This pic from COTBP shows how it's not wide enough, as Jack's shoulders protrude above the shoulders sewn into the coat, you can also see the collar that the COTBP coat had.
[img]

Shirt collar is on top of the coat collar here. Same shot in HD:
https://2img.net/h/i1131.photobucket.com/albums/m552/captain_jack-sparrow/COTBP/PiratesOfTheCaribbeanTheCurseOfTheBlackPearl20031080pBluRayx264-WLM01526118-11-29.jpg

However the coat collar is on top of the shirt collar here:
https://2img.net/h/i1131.photobucket.com/albums/m552/captain_jack-sparrow/COTBP/PiratesOfTheCaribbeanTheCurseOfTheBlackPearl20031080pBluRayx264-WLM01289822-23-53.jpg

And here:
https://2img.net/h/i1131.photobucket.com/albums/m552/captain_jack-sparrow/AWE/PiratesOfTheCaribbeanAtWorldsEnd20071080pBluRayDTSx264-hV14024803-22-16.jpg
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

Post  Bilge Rat on Sun Oct 09, 2011 6:46 pm

All the screen used coats also have a seam going down the top center of the cuffs, those coats in MoJos example does not have that seam. There is also a seam that runs down the front center of the sleeve, then somewhat angles back to the inside of the arm running upwards towards the armpit.And all the coats in all the films had the small raised collar.
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Re: The Frock Coat Collar

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